customer skipped town.... what's it worth?! - FRETS.NET2024-03-29T10:52:14Zhttp://fretsnet.ning.com/forum/topics/customer-skipped-town-whats-it?commentId=2177249%3AComment%3A60404&feed=yes&xn_auth=noI know nothing of Indiana but…tag:fretsnet.ning.com,2011-06-23:2177249:Comment:605142011-06-23T16:22:44.349ZRob Mercurehttp://fretsnet.ning.com/profile/RobMercure
<p>I know nothing of Indiana but OH and KY, as well as VA, can be covered by the initial work agreement thus precluding the repairshop from anything other than a single notice that the item is repaired and awaiting pickup. A friend's sister who is a local judge in Virginia suggested the registered letter route or at least a formal notice that the item will be sold but legally it's not necessarily if prior language covers it. Now someone who's "valued family heirloom" that you've sold's…</p>
<p>I know nothing of Indiana but OH and KY, as well as VA, can be covered by the initial work agreement thus precluding the repairshop from anything other than a single notice that the item is repaired and awaiting pickup. A friend's sister who is a local judge in Virginia suggested the registered letter route or at least a formal notice that the item will be sold but legally it's not necessarily if prior language covers it. Now someone who's "valued family heirloom" that you've sold's attorney will threaten bloody murder but legally that doesn't hold water under the Uninform Commercial Code (everybody in business should have one or at least know where to find it at the local library) - and one should have a glancing familiarity with the Contract Law (a contract being any agreement entered into voluntarily by two or more parties - other than real estate verbal agreements are not binding and extremely hard to enforce). Having attorney friends who are judges, prosecuting attorney's (we call the "Commonwealth's Attorney" in Virginia) and public defender I can comfortably state that if you cover you crack with the initial agreement language and then stick to what you agreed to then a nasty's client's lawyer can scream bloody murder until they are blue in the face- just make sure to counterfile any motion that they may make cuz' if they claim that you are a three headed monkey brain eating space alien and you don't legally deny it then the monkey's of the world are more threatened than they were to begin with. But it's only if you let them make at "statement" and don't defend yourself legally that they will win.</p>
<p>Rob</p> Indiana's laws are similar to…tag:fretsnet.ning.com,2011-06-20:2177249:Comment:604042011-06-20T17:58:28.833ZMark Wallacehttp://fretsnet.ning.com/profile/MarkWallaceMarksFretShop
Indiana's laws are similar to that of OH and Ky. Certified letter or some formal mode of notification and then a 30 day wait. I had an early 70's Martin 12 string that sat here for almost 2 years ($150 repair). I called the customer several times and I guess she was just busy with other things. When I had all but figured it was now mine she decided to come pick it up.
Indiana's laws are similar to that of OH and Ky. Certified letter or some formal mode of notification and then a 30 day wait. I had an early 70's Martin 12 string that sat here for almost 2 years ($150 repair). I called the customer several times and I guess she was just busy with other things. When I had all but figured it was now mine she decided to come pick it up. Mike,
I'll dust it off and…tag:fretsnet.ning.com,2011-06-20:2177249:Comment:601332011-06-20T03:02:42.272ZRob Mercurehttp://fretsnet.ning.com/profile/RobMercure
<p>Mike,</p>
<p> </p>
<p>I'll dust it off and send you a copy within the next few weeks - it's in the 2003 version of MS Word/Excel but you can sever the Excel part, Word has some internal calc. functions, since I was primarily doing electronics the Excel part is linked to an inventory spread sheet for a couple of what were then my primary vendors. That way when I wanted to place an order I loaded this document to see if there was something else I was forgetting.</p>
<p>Most states allow you…</p>
<p>Mike,</p>
<p> </p>
<p>I'll dust it off and send you a copy within the next few weeks - it's in the 2003 version of MS Word/Excel but you can sever the Excel part, Word has some internal calc. functions, since I was primarily doing electronics the Excel part is linked to an inventory spread sheet for a couple of what were then my primary vendors. That way when I wanted to place an order I loaded this document to see if there was something else I was forgetting.</p>
<p>Most states allow you to also add "carrying charges" - interest on unpaid amounts - with some, DE I believe, going as far as 24% APR. While my spiritual beliefs are a personal workable muddle I was raise Catholic and up until the middle ages the "Seven Deadly Sins" included "Usery" - loaning money for profit (this fall within that category of Roman Catholic official church beliefs - like celibate clergy - that the church claims it's never changed but has done so frequency - Catholics realized they were losing too much money in interest to Jews so "Usury" was changed to "Avarice," I believe - can't remember now). Anyhoo, although I could, and most businesses do, charge interest on unpaid amounts I've always felt uncomfortable with the idea as I do with any of those "businesses" that make a profit simply by shifting paper/amounts and don't actually produce anything - to me that's much more "sinful" and was the origin of the Usary ban. I do have some blurb on the invoice stating my right to charge interest "up to the current applicable state limit - I believe you can also allow language that provides for reimbursement for the costs of collection of due amount (but I feel these people are leeches within an industry rife with fraud and have never done so) so this may be a wise CYA that I'm ignoring.</p>
<p>Most localities have community colleges that every year or two offer a short course (about 5 evenings) on the paperwork side of small business management including necessary book keeping to keep the Feds off you back side in the unlikely case you get caught up in someone' audit - I used to teach a short course called something like "Handyman Book Keeping" or such back in the mid 1990s (long out of date by now I'm sure). But I'd check my local CC or even city govt. (during the Reagan yuppie years there were more individuals in adult ed. in Fairfax Co., VA than elementary school students!).</p>
<p>Sorry for the long answer but I believe the subject is applicable to all of us who are truly "small business-folk" (US Federal definition is 100 or fewer employees - that would be a major employer 'round these parts now).</p>
<p> </p>
<p>Rob</p> Good thoughts, Rob. I should…tag:fretsnet.ning.com,2011-06-18:2177249:Comment:601312011-06-18T14:37:53.748ZMike Kolbhttp://fretsnet.ning.com/profile/MikeKolb
<p>Good thoughts, Rob. I should probably make a stock repair order form and get things more "formal and solidified". </p>
<p>The reality of working with individual customers has sorta' crept up on me. I started this little repair venture by doing repairs for 2 (sometimes 3) music stores in the area. It was nice to have the stores as the interface.... they would deal-with the individual customers and my only interaction with them was a phone call now & again to give in-hand estimates or…</p>
<p>Good thoughts, Rob. I should probably make a stock repair order form and get things more "formal and solidified". </p>
<p>The reality of working with individual customers has sorta' crept up on me. I started this little repair venture by doing repairs for 2 (sometimes 3) music stores in the area. It was nice to have the stores as the interface.... they would deal-with the individual customers and my only interaction with them was a phone call now & again to give in-hand estimates or ask q's about playing style or preferences, etc. </p>
<p>Fast-forward to now, and many of these customers have opted to bypass the music stores and call me directly... or have recommended me to friends and they will call. Not complaining, mind you, but it's probably time to whip-up some sort of paperwork. If yours if available for a gander, I surely wouldn't mind taking a look and see if it's applicable for me? </p> Mike,
I don't know if you've…tag:fretsnet.ning.com,2011-06-17:2177249:Comment:601292011-06-17T20:43:28.147ZRob Mercurehttp://fretsnet.ning.com/profile/RobMercure
<p>Mike,</p>
<p>I don't know if you've got the language on your estimate/service agreement but in Virginia it's a common requirement that the customer pay, or initially start to pay, within 30 days of an agreed upon completion date or notification of completion. - the same in KY, TN, and OH. Afterward if the customer doesn't make arrangements suitable to the service center for payment and keep up with those payment the instrument may be sold for the cost of repairs plus a reasonable fee for…</p>
<p>Mike,</p>
<p>I don't know if you've got the language on your estimate/service agreement but in Virginia it's a common requirement that the customer pay, or initially start to pay, within 30 days of an agreed upon completion date or notification of completion. - the same in KY, TN, and OH. Afterward if the customer doesn't make arrangements suitable to the service center for payment and keep up with those payment the instrument may be sold for the cost of repairs plus a reasonable fee for dealing with the matter. No notification letter need be sent if this language is included in/on the original "proceed with work" agreement! And no one in the repair business should ever initiate repairs, order parts, or provide other than a brief description of work to be performed without a signed agreement.</p>
<p>I've got a stock form worked up on my computer in MS Word (linked to a Excel document for when things get complicated) that I can fill in, print off, and produce two "originals" - one for the customer and one for me (the document captures name, address, phone, e-mail and other electronic contact and, where not paying with cash or requiring a deposit, bank account contact and/or debit/credit card information with an agreement not to copy this and to destroy it in the customer's presence if fully paid in time - along with a reasonable service charge for handling debt depending on customer history including personal). Most of this I had in the 1990s while managing my own home shop the rest of which I "stole" (acquired with permission) when I managed a much larger long established electronics service shop. Perfectly legal, honorable, method of doing business that limits your "exposure" to 30 days by agreement.</p>
<p>Rob</p> if you want your money just c…tag:fretsnet.ning.com,2011-06-14:2177249:Comment:601982011-06-14T17:51:14.135ZFRANKhttp://fretsnet.ning.com/profile/PAUL
if you want your money just charge for your repair, The guy defaulted over 1 year if 10 of your customers did this what would you do ...Blast it out on Face Book Craigs list and etsy charge $150 it will go quickly or maby save it for when you get one of those terriable repars in that you believe the customer will be happier with the Yamaha instead Or give it to a child it would be the greatest gift to Give Giving a child future is like ensuring Our Future as Luthiers...
if you want your money just charge for your repair, The guy defaulted over 1 year if 10 of your customers did this what would you do ...Blast it out on Face Book Craigs list and etsy charge $150 it will go quickly or maby save it for when you get one of those terriable repars in that you believe the customer will be happier with the Yamaha instead Or give it to a child it would be the greatest gift to Give Giving a child future is like ensuring Our Future as Luthiers... Hi Ned.
Please e-mail me at …tag:fretsnet.ning.com,2011-06-14:2177249:Comment:600382011-06-14T17:37:58.419ZPaul Verticchiohttp://fretsnet.ning.com/profile/PaulVerticchio
<p>Hi Ned.</p>
<p>Please e-mail me at gtrtech@frontier.com</p>
<p>I may be able to help you out with a few beaters for your church.</p>
<p>Thx,</p>
<p>Paul</p>
<p>Hi Ned.</p>
<p>Please e-mail me at gtrtech@frontier.com</p>
<p>I may be able to help you out with a few beaters for your church.</p>
<p>Thx,</p>
<p>Paul</p> Good point, Chris. Thanks for…tag:fretsnet.ning.com,2011-06-14:2177249:Comment:602842011-06-14T17:04:46.590ZMike Kolbhttp://fretsnet.ning.com/profile/MikeKolb
<p>Good point, Chris. Thanks for the reality check. It's been a year so I'm no hurry.... I'll send a certified letter to his last known address (now vacant), wait for it come back and then wait a month. It's never been as issue up to this point, so it's not something I'm accustomed to dealing-with. </p>
<p>Insofar as the value goes, I'd be pleased to sell it for $180, which would give me my $150 and the store owner can get his $30. If it goes for less, then I'm still breaking-even to a certain…</p>
<p>Good point, Chris. Thanks for the reality check. It's been a year so I'm no hurry.... I'll send a certified letter to his last known address (now vacant), wait for it come back and then wait a month. It's never been as issue up to this point, so it's not something I'm accustomed to dealing-with. </p>
<p>Insofar as the value goes, I'd be pleased to sell it for $180, which would give me my $150 and the store owner can get his $30. If it goes for less, then I'm still breaking-even to a certain extent... and learning something along the way.</p>
<p>Thanks to all for the input.... much appreciated. </p> CYA.... Most states require t…tag:fretsnet.ning.com,2011-06-14:2177249:Comment:601952011-06-14T11:17:43.967ZChris Rochowhttp://fretsnet.ning.com/profile/ChrisRochow
CYA.... Most states require that you send a certified letter to the owner... even if it is returned.... it proves that you made an effort to contact the owner. Plus, most sates require that you wait 30 days after serving (or attempting to serve), before you can sell for the cost of repairs.
CYA.... Most states require that you send a certified letter to the owner... even if it is returned.... it proves that you made an effort to contact the owner. Plus, most sates require that you wait 30 days after serving (or attempting to serve), before you can sell for the cost of repairs. I'd try to get @ $400'cause i…tag:fretsnet.ning.com,2011-06-14:2177249:Comment:594802011-06-14T11:10:20.198ZTim Macehttp://fretsnet.ning.com/profile/TimMace478
I'd try to get @ $400'cause if it was made in the 70's and in great shape you know it'll outplay anything in that range these days and no China stickers is a plus! ching ching!I've played some sweet FG-150's....Guess I'm dreamin',hunh?I'll give you$75 which is half of what it says on the label!
I'd try to get @ $400'cause if it was made in the 70's and in great shape you know it'll outplay anything in that range these days and no China stickers is a plus! ching ching!I've played some sweet FG-150's....Guess I'm dreamin',hunh?I'll give you$75 which is half of what it says on the label!