What are these tuners worth?

[JasonG]

Hi everyone this looks like a great forum I can't wait to see how it develops. These look like pre ww2 plate tuners that are missing one post so they are really only good for parts but what is there is in pretty good shape.
A little bit about me. I have been fixing and modding guitars since I first started playing 18 years but have branched out to more advanced stuff over the last 2 years. I am building my first guitar right now it will be a Les Paul recording clone with some modern tweeks. With the way the weather is here in the midwest its not likely to get done till spring.

[danove]

Can't tell the worth of your tuners Jason, but they seem of wrought rather than of casted iron.
Give us the measures of the missing parts. Maybe someone got a spare for you.

PS
I have the Gibson Recording and curious about yor planned tweeks.

[JasonG]

As for the tuners I just need to know if they are worth anything. So that I can sell them to someone who works on guitars of that vintage. If they are nothing special I will just stick them back in my tuner parts box.
As for the Les Paul recording. I am going to use modern hardware ,locking tune o matic , locking tuners, and its getting a bigsby with a vibramate adaptor. I am going to use a scarf joint for the head stock, and I will reinforce the neck at the headstock so I don't get any of the Gibson breaks. The neck profile will be the same as my 89 Epi SG, I think its an early 60's Gibson profile. I am going to use a Hamer style joint at the body. I scored a bunch of bubinga 2 years ago and have made the body out of that, its thinner than a real Les paul but should have just as much sustain. Carving the top was a lot easier than I ever though it would be. :-)
I am still trying to figure out what I want to do about the pickups. I may get some Q tuners, Bill Lawrence "wilde" brand pickups or I may wind my own. I would really rather buy them but I have been reading up on how diy pickups and I could do it if I had to. I want to pickups to have a wider band with than the originals had. I have not played one in a few years but I have heard some clips of the record Gibson made to help sell them back in the 70's they are Hi Fi for sure but time marches on and we can get the same range and more without a transformer. I do understand that changing impednces and pot values will change how the controls respond but given my goals that seems unavoidable.
I think the control layout on the LPR is great. I am going to combine the LPR layout of the early version and the latter version. It will have the pickup switch up top and a smaller control plate with out the jack on it. I may may omit the LO/HI switch or I will put a decade bypass switch in its place. With newer hi fi pickups you can get and acoustic like sound out and I like the idea of being able to switch between full band and some preset decade setting.
I think Gibson should reissue the recording or at least make it as a guitar of the month. I think it was a great idea but too far ahead of its time. People are not afraid of all those switches any more.
I have been tempted to buy a Les Paul Ultra two because it can get the sounds I want but I am not a fan of active electronics and I can build the exact guitar I want cheaper.

[danove]

Thanks for the details Jason. Very interesting!
I do like the original low impedance pickups,
but of course modern electronics may improve things.
Please keep us informed as the building proceedes.

[JasonG]

Danove
Which version do you have? Is the one with the big control plate or the small one ?

[danove]

Mine has the smaller version control plate.
Still seems to be a -73 Kalamazoo according to S/N,
but that is not easily read out...

Very heavy guitar. Almost unusable without a stand.
Looooong sustain.

[JasonG]

The Gibson S/N's have always been crazy. The only thing you can trust is the modal history and numbers on the pots. If it has the small control plate and pickup switch up top then It must be a 78-80. That is the rare version of a rare guitar.
I am having a hard time figuring out the size of the small control plate and the pickup angles . Is there anyway you could take a caliper and measure the long straight part on top of the control plate and measure from the center of the tuneomatic to the center of the bridge pickup on both posts? I have a ton of pictures of LPR's but they are all low resolution and I cant blow them up to get any good measurements off of them.
LPR's have the sustain that is for sure. I have an instrucional dvd with Les and he does this lick and holds the last note forever. Thats when I got excited about locking Les paul bridges because I thought that would have the same effect.
Not wanting to spend the money on something I was not sure would work I made my own. 2 5/8 th's screws ( If I remember correctly and 4 washers) all stainless steel. Now I get that sustain on my SG. The bone nut I have on it helps but the bridge is clearly the main reason for most of the sustain. Too bad they did not figure out locking studs till recently. I think the 70's Gibson's would have been a lot lighter and Les would have a better back.

[danove]

The long straight part on top of the control plate is 146.5 cm
Center of ToM to center pickups are roughly 160cm and 50cm
Top of 12th fret to center pickups are 158cm and 268cm
Pickups are angled 74.5 degrees

Hope it helps

[JasonG]

Man you just saved me hours of frustration. Thank you ! :-)

[danove]

You are welcome Jason.
Do I understand you right - if I found replacement locking studs
for this "new design ToM bridge" it could improve further the
already amazing sustain?
- not that there is a need for it - but you know how things go.....

[JasonG]

My guess is that locking studs for the stoptail would help the most. The 70's Nashville style TOM that is on your guitar is what it is , they don't make locking studs for that.
You could replace it with an ABR TOM and use locking studs. Les even pulled the Nashville style off of most of his guitars. My guess is that it is not as stable as the ABR.
I think the main advantage of a locking TOM is with intonation but I am not sure because I only have a locking stop bar.