Classical guitar construction
Greetings to the classical guitar builders -- I have a question that needs to be answered-
I just received a set of plans to build a Jose' Ramirez classical guitar and the top and back seem to be flat rather than having a radius to it. is this the way it is made?????????
I will be attempting this guitar as soon as I get done making a 12 string dred. that I am working on now.
any help would be appreciated-- and thank you in advance for any replies....
Donald
I just received a set of plans to build a Jose' Ramirez classical guitar and the top and back seem to be flat rather than having a radius to it. is this the way it is made?????????
I will be attempting this guitar as soon as I get done making a 12 string dred. that I am working on now.
any help would be appreciated-- and thank you in advance for any replies....
Donald
Views: 2486
Replies to This Discussion
-
Permalink Reply by Cliff Morris on
-
Wow,
Bob, 1st let me thank you again for putting so much into answering all our questions. The cut and try didn't sound right but I have seen some pretty "iffy"practices in some of the various books I have looked through. One gave dimensions for a pretty wide slot and then said to shim the neck to fit. Sounded like a great way to end up with gaps all along the rib/neck joint and a weak joint to boot. I will make up some drawings and that should help clarify the angles and such.
-
Permalink Reply by Len Biglin on
-
Hi Guys , I am certainly no expert and have never made a classical guitar, but I use the Spanish foot method , starting with the soundboard , then attaching the neck and then the sides into the slots. I read that it is not necessary to glue the slots , as that joint offers no strength to the guitar.The stress in this area is all foreward .So I make the slots a little narrower than the side thickness and then sand the sides until they are a snug fit into the slots .I have not built for about 5 years now but I remember putting a shim under the nut area to get the angle , then I think I sanded the top from s/hole to neck joint so it matches the angle .Not much help but fun to discuss . Len
-
Permalink Reply by Donald A. Fortune on
-
Thanx for the reply Len -- anything said here is news of some sort and its a good thing to get info of all sorts when the project is a first timer, rather than using the trial an err method.
be safe and best to you,
Donald
-
Permalink Reply by Bob Webster on
-
In fact, some people don't glue the sides in. I guess it's a sort of paranoia gauge. When I've built in this fashion, I've cut just slightly wider slots and then glued 0.5mm thick pieces of veneer to the end of the sides. I then thin the veneer patches to fit the slots. It's just a little bit stronger that way, in theory. I think, really, that how one proceeds with this really depends on the kerf of the saw that you have relative to the side thickness.
Bob
-
-
Hi Bob I have to agree with you in gluing the sides to the neck slots.
I think the box would be srtonger that way making the neck stay put.
thanx for the post :)
Donald
-
-
Hi Bob -- I have a template to the remeriz guitar and Im giving LMI a call to find out if all or most of the classical guitars have the same outside profile-- if so then I have an idea for a form to put them together and I think it will work well... I'll keep you posted as to the progress...
Donald
P.S. I had the book that you sugested all the time and didnt reolize it -- DAAAAA
-
-
Actually, outlines for classical guitars vary pretty significantly from builder to builder both in shape and size. Moreover, the differences, along with body depth and soundhole diameter, end up defining the tonal palette and potential of the guitar. It's actually a fairly big deal.
Robert Ruck, for one, spent a long time exploring size and shape before he settled on the ones he's using now. Further, even something as simple as changing to a 640 scale from a 650 scale length can significantly alter the way a guitar works. Jose Ramirez III took three years to redevelop their 1a model for the now standard 650mm scale (previously 660mm) so that it had about the same power and tonal response as the previous 1as.
Are you trying to design a form that is adjustable to different shapes or what?
Cheers,
Bob
-
-
Hi Bob -- I thought if the outline of classicals were all the same for example-
I have a form for a dred. and another one for a OO. so therefore if the outline for classicals were the same then I could design a form from there. The scale length could be 650 mm or 650 meters for all of me -- that part doesn't matter.
I just thought I could come up with something that would make the job of assembly a lot easier than a flat work board that has me wondering if I am able to do this guitar or not. Perhaps if I get this one form done and operating then thats the shape that I will make... thanx again for the info... you are a welth of information :-) and ya do make me think, and thats a good thing .....
Donald
-
Permalink Reply by Ned Knepp on
-
I just want to point out that scale length can have an impact on body shape because a of bridge positioning.
Ned -
-
-
Hey Bob -- I was just looking at the print that I have and it depicts the finger board tapered from one end to the other (.250 at the bridge end and .235 at the nut end) this must be the compensation for not having the cut in the side of the neck at any angle .... in which to me seems like a better idea than trying to figure out the angle. ALSO there is a figure for the height of the bridge it self and the saddle I supose can be adjusted to give the player the action that they prefer.. sound about rite to you???
Donald
-
-
Sounds exactly right. The specific numbers that you end up with on the fingerboard will depend on how everything else goes together, bridge height, etc. Work to get the bass side of the saddle about 10mm from the top.
If you are going to work with the neck attached to the sides pretty much from the start, an outside mold is a little bit trickier, but not by much. There just need to be a neck-sized opening at the neck end and some way of supporting the neck at the right angle relative to the body. Relative to building a body separate from the neck, the outside mould loses alot of utlity or becomes a bit fiddly when you have the neck on from the start. On the other hand, setting up the jigs and fixtures to make the body joint also take some time and figuring. Truth, I'm probably doing the body and neck separately now just because I have it going that way and don't want to invest more work to switch back.
As for body shape, the Hauser isn't the sexiest shape around but it's been the basis for alot of good guitars, including Rucks and Elliotts. I've been using a small Santos Hernandez plantilla for my 640 scale guitars and either a Contreras or a Marin plantilla for my concert sized guitars.
Lastly, check out the blog I just posted on my page. It shows my outsid mould in action for gluing the body together.
Cheers,
Bob
-
-
Hey Bob -- Started making that form that I was talking about for the classical guitar
I will keep you posted and let you know how it comes out-- I went and got a neck with the spanish heel from LMII and it looks to be a real dandy-- I'm going to ust the neck to make up the mold.
so far my idea looks like it will work like a walk in the park..
I realize that the mold will only be good for the ramerez guitar but if I need one for another one then I think I can make one for that model too-- (maby)
cheers,
Donald
© 2024 Created by Frank Ford.
Powered by
