Taylor 214 heel crack

[Kevin cConlon]

I am fixing  some damage to a Taylor 214 for a friend of mine who came off a flight and found his guitar neck was cracked at the heel. Its a Taylor 214 and I remember Frank or someone posting a while ago about the neck system taylor use, so I am wondering if anyone has had this problem. Its a clean crack and it had me wondering if indeed it was a crack at all but perhaps the joint had loosened because there's a bolt screwed into the fall away section of the fingerboard that can be accessed through the soundhole and that was a little loose. When I did tighten it up a bit it did indeed pull the crack tighter but not enough so it has had some knock or damage.  My intention is to get some hide glue in there and clamp it. Because of the nature of the Taylor neck its going to be very difficult for anyone coming along in a few years to a neck re set if I glue it up tightly but what option do I have.? Anyone know if taylor actually use glue when fitting this type of neck. 

Any info appreciated 

Kevin

[Kevin cConlon]

ahh--no pics loaded --sorry. trying again

[Kevin cConlon]

[Kevin cConlon]

So what you guys think ? Titebond Liquid Hide Glue     or     ordinary yellow Titebond ?

[Greg Mirken]

The whole rest of the guitar is glued together with Titebond,,, so why not.

Liquid hide glue is fine if it hasn't been sitting on the store shelf for a long time. I bet the shock that broke that heel would've broken either.

[Kevin cConlon]

Thanks Greg,

 Funnily enough I did notice the expiry date on my Liquid Hide glue was last month. I contacted my supplier who said it should be ok to use for the rest of this year so I hope they are correct. But , you are correct about the titebond so I will most likely go with that.

Thanks for your input

Kevin

[Hesh Breakstone]

I hate the bottled hide glue and it's not at all the same stuff as hot hide glue....  I personally would not use it for anything except to perhaps mix with dust and make a filler... if I ever used any filler.

Hot hide glue, the real stuff..., would be my first choice if the break is clean and the wood-to-wood contact, once you pick out any bent fibers interfering with the fit, is excellent.  Where HHG is not appropriate is it's not a gap filler and requires an excellent wood-to-wood fit.

Where HHG shines is in applications where serviceability is important or, in other words, someone may have to take the glue joint apart someday.  Although this break need not be serviceable HHG is also excellent where the wood-to-wood contact is excellent and from the looks of your pics this may.. be the case here.

It's more involved to use though, you have to have your dry runs (clamping...) down and preheating the parts (without smoking the finish) extends the open time.  If you can clamp things up well in your dry runs in say 20 - 30 seconds AND preheat the parts with a thermostatically controlled, variable heat gun set to a safe temp for finishes HHG would be my first choice.

Nothing wrong with Titebond "original" either but again if the fit is good I'd use HHG - the real stuff.

Search some of the other forums for experiences with "liquid hide glue" and you will find that I am not at all alone in my disdain for the stuff....  You will find many folks either having bad experiences with it for structural repairs and/or advising others to avoid it too.

So since you asked my vote goes to HHG or Titebond "original" if you are not set-up to use HHG.

[Greg Mirken]

Kevin, throw the expired bottle of liquid hide glue away- using questionable glue is false economy. The reason the stuff has such a bad rep is that at some point it just doesn't harden, ever.

[Mark Pollock]

Okay - why the heck is Taylor using dowels in this spot? Does that strike anybody else as being a bit odd?

It also looks like some of the joint split, and some of the wood split. Hide glue won't be happy where there was already glue, so I would go with Titebond original.

[Thomas James]

Titebond for the extra time to get things aligned and clamped.  It is certainly plenty strong enough for this job. It also has an expiration date.

[Michael Moody II]

At Taylor they are all about ease of production. My guess mark is that they use the dowels so that the joint doesn't slide around on them. They can just slap the glue on and clamp and everything stays aligned. They even do the scarf joints with a bit of a "S" or squiggle in the cut so that the headstock doesn't creep off the neck under clamping pressure. They are always trying to find ways to improve things it seems.

[Greg Mirken]

In Taylor's defense, Michael, the same can be said of Martin now or in the 1970s, Gibson in 1930, or Maytag or Honda for that matter. The most expensive 'part' of just about any manufactured product is the man-hours to make it.

[Hesh Breakstone]

Greg my friend can we leave Honda out of it please?  ;)  I love my Honda!!