New Gibson and Epiphone tap pot failures

[Brian Hart]

So, I've had both new Gibson and Epiphone guitars in for bad pots.  The push / push pots just stop working and turn into a pogo stick, and the shaft pulls out of the push / pull pots.  The Gibsons have push / push pots that are easy enough to rewire, but impossible to find.  I finally found a few on ebay and bought everything the guy had but will be running out soon.  Then on to the Epiphone instruments, with a horrible PC board multi pin connector on them.  Gibson will not sell these to me even as a parts only account, and reverse engineering them to a standard alpha push pull is extremely technical.  I have only successfully done it once, which I think was more luck than anything.  My questions would be, has anybody drawn up a diagram for re-connecting the leads from the PC board setup to a standard pot, and is there anywhere where I can get long shaft push push pots regularly?  Maybe I need to make friends with a reputable Gibson dealer.

[Paul Verticchio]

Check: Antique Electronics; WD & All Parts. Also check Mouser Electronics; Allied Electronics; and DigiKey Electronics.

As far as the pot to the PCB... simply imagine a hard wire running from the PCB to the connections on the pot.

Yes, it is technical and time consuming but you'll have to learn to do these types of things. In this trade, necessity truly is the mother of invention.

If you need more info from the forum members, the models of the instruments will be immensely helpful as would photos.

A last ditch effort would be to contact a Gibson Service provider & source the items through him/her. The downside to that is that it will cost significantly more than sourcing the products yourself AND you'll receive the same crummy quality items.

Also, in 40+ years of working on electrics, I've never heard of a push-push pot. Can you fill me in as to what these are?

[Brian Hart]

Thanks for the list of vendors.  I was familiar with a few but there's a couple new ones to me there too.  On the pcb version, I was able to re-trace all of the least after a lot of observation and hand drawn schematics.  I was able to repair one guitar, but another came in and for whatever reason, the same approach didn't work.  I don't have one in my shop at the moment but if it comes up again, i'll have more to report.  As for the push push pot, you press the knob down and it stays down, push it again and it pops up.  They would be great on the instruments if they didn't fail, especially since trying to pull up on a top flush skirted knob is pretty clumsy feeling.

[Russell Vance]

500K push/push pots at Allparts.com

EP-0296-000 500K Push Push Audio Pot 

sorry about the big font - that's how it copied.  I have had a very bad two weeks of Gibsons - I have held fire because I am in a bad mood from having to make excuses  for their appalling workmanship (even by my moderated and time worn professional opinion) to hapless clients who still believe in that brand.   Is it too much to ask them to put a neck on straight - I won't labor the other points - it would be churlish and unprofessional to really unload on this but they really deserve a hiding. 

Rusty.

[Brian Hart]

I remember coming across that Allparts pot, and it will probably get me by.  I think the only reason I stressed myself finding long shaft pots was to have enough clearance for the lock washers in carve top guitars.  With a standard shaft, I had to go washer-less.  I'm pretty bad with censoring myself on Gibson's quality these days too.  I get reactions as if i'm telling somebody they were adopted for the first time.  

[Paul Verticchio]

"I get reactions as if i'm telling somebody they were adopted for the first time."

What a perfect analogy.

Thanks Brian :)

[Mark A. Kane]

Not to hijack the thread but I could have written this reply verbatim. I'm constantly entertained (or horrified) at Gibson's stunning lack of quality control. Thank goodness I don't handle warranty issues for them, as I'd never get anything else done.

[Paul Young]

A quality CTS or Alpha pot and separate mini-toggle switch is a lot less headaches in my humble opinion.  Only problem is a new hole to be drilled.

[Paul Verticchio]

Thanks for that info on the push-push pot, Brian. I guess I began outsourcing complex guitar wiring work before they began using them.  In my opinion, those switches are too fragile for use in a guitar under actual performance conditions. It's that 'one more thing that can go wrong....and WILL'. :)

Without hijacking the post..Rusty: I hear ya mate. I've been ranting about Gibson's crap quality for a few years now. If there were such a thing as a "Morals and Ethics Prison",  Henry J. would be the prettiest girl on his cell block. Buying a new Gibson is like pouring money into a black hole.... just to have the name on the headstock. The head stock logo should read "SUCKER".

Thanks guys :)

[tadej bratkovic]

Brian, newer Gibson pots are also soldered to a PCB. I am not sure, but I think newer pots are outsourced and made by Bourns now. That's what I figured out, since I carry Bourns electronics exclusively, I can tell these look pretty much identical. Bourns even makes pots for Seymour Duncan.

For mounting to a PCB you will need the prong type lugs, not the eyelet ones like regular point-to-point wirings incorporate. I did a few of these, mainly on Gibsons and on a few Godin's too.

I like the idea of a PCB to some extent, it makes everything look neat, but is not meant for exchanging components back and forth. The copper plating and tabs get destroyed in no time. Still, nothing beats the old PTP design.