New Martin d28 B String Buzzes Tried evertything

[Charles]

Bought a 2008 Martin D-28 new from a shop going out of business.
It played fine at the shop.

After playing it for an Hour, lots of lead and string bending, B string sounds Dead. It doesnt "ring" but sounds thuddy.

Took it to a Authorized service, what a joke. He made a new bridge, charged me $150 and no dif. Started adjusting the Truss, no diference.

Light strings. Any Ideas b4 I ship it up to Penn?

[Charles]

Thanks Ned.

I agree, an intermitten problem like this is a pain to find and a systematic approach is needed.

Just a few more notes.

Other ppl can hear the "Twang" , I thought might just be me as well, but it isn't

I tried using as little pressure on the neck as possible when I play. Might be something to it as it takes longer for the twang to happen. I dont know how the neck attaches to the guitar but it might be loose. If I pull the neck back, even with moderate pressure, I can see the gap decrease between the strings and frets .If I push the neck forward, the twang decreases for a short while, It always comes back. After sitting over night, the twang is gone until i play about 15 mins.

I put Medium strings on in leau of lights, sounds nice, twang may be a little better. I have over 100 hours on the guitar. Maybe the frets are wearing some. Maybe it will one day go away. Over all it seems to be getting a little better. I got a feeling it wont totally go away. I might be learning how to play around it, picking higher up the guitar, staying off those notes.

My whole life I wanted a Martin D28. Played guitar 40 years. I finally get one and its a nightmare. I might just trade it in, take the huge loss and get a Gibson or something. Too bad, I like the sound other than the twang.

I really appriciate the help here.

Thanks

[Jimmy Holsinger]

I have a Martin DVM and I have to tune the second string sweet so i dont have the twang!!!!

[Charles]

Thanks Ned.

I agree, an intermitten problem like this is a pain to find and a systematic approach is needed.

Just a few more notes.

Other ppl can hear the "Twang" , I thought might just be me as well, but it isn't

I tried using as little pressure on the neck as possible when I play. Might be something to it as it takes longer for the twang to happen. I dont know how the neck attaches to the guitar but it might be loose. If I pull the neck back, even with moderate pressure, I can see the gap decrease between the strings and frets .If I push the neck forward, the twang decreases for a short while, It always comes back. After sitting over night, the twang is gone until i play about 15 mins.

I put Medium strings on in leau of lights, sounds nice, twang may be a little better. I have over 100 hours on the guitar. Maybe the frets are wearing some. Maybe it will one day go away. Over all it seems to be getting a little better. I got a feeling it wont totally go away. I might be learning how to play around it, picking higher up the guitar, staying off those notes.

My whole life I wanted a Martin D28. Played guitar 40 years. I finally get one and its a nightmare. I might just trade it in, take the huge loss and get a Gibson or something. Too bad, I like the sound other than the twang.

I really appriciate the help here.

Thanks

[Charles]

I made a youtube video demonstrating the sound
please chech it out and let me know what you think

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CKtUxSBJvD0

Thanks

[Rob Mercure]

Charles,

Every manufacture has "lemons" and I wouldn't abandon Martin due to one sample. While I don't want to slur any manufacturer - especially a "venerable" one - having worked closely with a factory repairman/luthier doing warrantly work for over a dozen brands I'd have to say that your alternative has far more bad units produced, has far worse warranty support - especially supporting field repairmen - and is more likely to create a similar or worse situation.

Unfotunately if you buy "anything" new, pretty much, with few exemptions (Dumble amps are one ) you are going to take a loss if you resell it within a short time. Same goes for cars, motorcycles, and other musical equipment. So if you wind up dumping this problem D-28 why not shop around for a nice used one that you know has satisfied some other musician(s)? Since you've played for so long you know that all acoustic guitars benefit from being "broken in" and really don't gain the richness and complexity of tonal signature without frequent, hard, playing. A couple of years ago I played an early '70s D-18 which, while being a nice sounding Martin, also sounded "show-room new" with much brightness but much less complexity than my 1980 D-25K which I've "played the hell out of" (Willy and I are in competition for top wear but he's got a 30 year, or so, head start !).

So don't give up on Martin - IMHO I still believe that they are the best of the large producers and, on average, you'd have to go to an individual luthier to find a better instrument. There a many luthiers who produce good instruments who haven't the reputation to charge big bucks yet who make great guitars and most of the ones I've known will take back their own instrument in trade for a later model. So they often have some of their first efforts which play great but aren't as fancy available for quite a bargain. And if you can stand learning a new skill - my repair/building experience comes from taking care of my own stock - you could buy a kit from LMI or others and make yourself a "D-28-ish" clone for little money and lots of time.

Your path if fraught with opportunity !

Rob

[Charles]

I made a youtube video demonstrating the sound
Check it out let me know what you think,
THanks all

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CKtUxSBJvD0

[Bob Gaddis]

It's not definitive on the video. It does sound sort of twangy and sounds like a better saddle profile is in order. I'd have to lay hands on it to determine how it feels and sounds. Generally speaking , if the annoying sound occurs at every fret,or several frets you still may have in no particular order:
1: a saddle problem-top not shaped right, bottom not seated right, not tall enough
2. a cracked or loose bridge or a bridge pin seating problem
3. a loose bridge plate
4. a loose brace
5. neck relief not right
6. Loose truss rod
7. A twisted neck
8. high or loose frets or frets not crowned correctly


if it was in my shop, I'f fit a new bone nut and saddle(especially if a synthetic nut and saddle are fitted), check neck relief and level and crown of frets. I'd also check the bridge plate and bracing and neck block to make sure they are tightly glued

[Ned Knepp]

I think I understand what you are hearing. I can't see anything in your attack that might account for it ( I know a kid that can make any guitar buzz like a bee. ) If what I hear is what you hear, I can't come up with anything better than the list that Bob posted. What I hear doesn't sound so much like a buzz or a thump to me as it sounds like resonance or an overtone. ( It actually sounds like a dead/dying string to me) I can understand, now, why the tech you took it to thought it was the bridge. That's probably where I would start looking too.

Your comments about the neck make me wonder if your truss rod is working correctly. I don't know how hard you have to pull or how great the change in action is but the neck should return to it's original position. It doesn't seem right that you can push on the neck and notice an improvement for a period of time. You might try checking your neck with a straight edge then check again after you push on it. You should not be able to make a semi permanent change simply by pushing or pulling on the neck. Pushing on the neck would also effect the compression on the frets which may help with a loose fret situation too.

It's a real puzzle.

Ned

[Rob Mercure]

Any possibility of a loose truss rod resonating? I've never experienced this but I've read of others having the problem.

Rob

[leparker]

I had a customer with same problem, same frets on A string. He'd had to 3 shops; I used my fret rocker and found uneven frets. Leveled and crowned, problem solved. I've check back with customer to make sure and he said it sounded great.
????????

[Bob Gaddis]

I'm thinking the same thing. If a correct saddle profile and proper neck relief doesn't fix it, I'd have my fret rocker and high-glare inspection light shining on the suspect frets. All the other things are possible, but not probable. This fret job may have been done on Monday morning by a hard-partying workman. How it would get past QC remains a mystery.

I bought an new HD-28 a couple of years ago and the finish started peeling like a bad sunburn. After inspection, Martin replaced the guitar.

[Ned Knepp]

Seems like we are all thinking the same thing. Frets. There's any number of thing is might be and, as I said earlier I probably would have started with the bridge but that's been changed.

I'm still concerned about the idea that Charles might be able to make the problem better simply by pushing on the neck. That doesn't sound right to me.

Ned