Binding repair/old Gibson

[Ry Charters]

Howdy,
A customer brought in her 70s gibson 12 string. Its in great shape, with the exception of the binding that suffered some heat/humidity damage. The lacquer over the binding is hanging on for dear life, and the celluloid is very cracked almost everywhere. She wants is replaced to look new again. Problem is, this stuff is thick. Around .075" or so. LMI offers .065" in tortoise shell. As I see it, my options are either going with a thicker ivoroid, rosewood, or laminating something behind the shell to make it the right width. Does anyone know of a place to buy thick binding from? Any other tips I'm not thinking of?
Thanks

[Scott Supak]

I've had good luck with Axiom,Inc for tortoise, anyway.
Don't forget the "hazardous material" shipping upcharge that most vendors apply to celluloid, more than the actual product costs.
I guess the extra $$$ prevents spontaneous combustion...

[Ry Charters]

Yes! Thanks for turning me on to this supplier Scott. Now I can finally build my bomb....er, I mean, repair the guitar. I think I'll give their Duco cement a try as well.

[Carl Mesrobian]

Money not to burn..

[griff]

I recently made this same repair to an early 70s Gibson J55, I took the extra space as an opportunity to set off the tortoise with b/w purfling which I thought framed the binding nicely. I wouldn't use the Duco cement though (I've never liked the way it goes on), I'd just use CA glue. Either way, it's a tricky job, good luck.

[nathan clark]

I guess these tips aren't relevant to the gibson 12 string at hand but for what it's worth...

Water based original titebond works pretty well for regluing a guitar's original celluloid binding if it's been removed to the neck block to relieve the stress at the waste (I'm pretty sure that's a Frank Ford trick from frets.com).

For new celluloid binding on shellac finished guitars you can make a paste by melting some of the new binding in acetone and use that as a glue. That's nice because you get a strong initial tack allowing you to use your fingers to clamp it down. IMPORTANT: I've only used this method a couple of times and both times it was on older instruments with shellac finishes. It worked fine in that context but acetone doesn't mess with shellac like it does with nitrocellulose...

[Ry Charters]

Well, the binding is off after quite an ordeal. It already had a b/w offset on it, that had to be removed as well as it was really melted to the celluloid in many spots. I think I'm going to have to use .125" tortoise so that I can recut the channels a little deeper and clean them up. Next step is butelcellusolve to melt the chipped finish back down and create good adhesion for the new finish.
I've used the stumac binding cement before and it worked very well....but the amount of cancer warnings on there made me start looking for something else. There's a good chance I'll just tape under the binding ledge and use CA gel. This is such a messy repair.......

[Ry Charters]

So.......I went to buy my binding material from axiom, inc and they're gone. Any other suppliers that you guys might know about?

[Russell Vance]

Ry, I'd be inclined to laminate up a black strip of binding to the back of the tortise binding to bulk it up - if you can't source thicker tortise that is. R.

[Ry Charters]

I think that's the ticket. Or, I could go to china and start knocking on doors looking for thicker binding.
Thanks Rusty.

[Fred Riggen]

Axiom,Inc website is back up.

[Ry Charters]

awesome. thanks fred, I was just about to order elsewhere.

[LARRY KLOSE]

LMI has a nice binding cement that I've used for several repairs with great results.  It's a contact type cement but without the rubbery filler that most CC's have.  It handles easily with a brush, cleans up with acetone, had a good open time but fast tack and there's NO SQUEEZE OUT!  The acetone cleanup allows using an artist brush for delicate applications.  It far outclasses a previous repair job I did with ACC which gave me lots of grief with squeeze out and short open time.  Whether it would work as well with a complete binding job is something I can't personally answer--maybe LMI can give you references.  In the description a couple of users are quoted and Frank is mentioned.

http://www.lmii.com/products/finishing/adhesives/binding-adhesives

The one I use is the FCA product.  Works well for other wood to plastic applications, too--including with plastics and resins that won't bond with ACC.

Larry