Sapele for necks

[Jack Lord]

Is sapele as good as mahogany for necks?

[Dave Fox]

To the best of my knowledge.  Als, I seem to recall that sapele is actually a var. of mahogany?  someone  correct me if not.

 

dave fox

[Rob Mercure]

Marketed as "mahogany" but totally different genus and part of the world (africa vs north, south, & central Americas and Carribean).  Luan is marketed as "Phillipine mahogany" but if you've worked with the stuff (plywood material IMHO) it's a very ersatz substitute. Better just to call sapele "sapele" than confuse the issue.  Mahoganies are in the Swietenia genus just like rosewoods are Dahlbergia, maples Acer, and walnuts Juglans - otherwise it's just marketing BS!  Sorry, but just getting to be a cranky old poot who's getting tired of commercial lying (in my Commercial Law classes in undergrad it's referred to as "puffery" - which I interpret as "full of hot air").

 

Snowed for three days and cranky - Rob

[Kerry Krishna]

Rob, it should be good for necks though right? It has been being used as a back and side wood for a long long time ( I have seen some guitars from the 30s with it, I am pretty sure). What do you think?

[Doug T]

I have used it for a few necks since locating plank mahogany around here is difficult at best (and those I've looked at are just sapele anyway).  My local Big B sells it under the name "Red Mahogany" and I've had good results with it.  They used to sell black walnut and walnut from the local orchards, but have stopped resawing local material and purely just from material they order.  I loved walnut for necks.

Doug

[Rob Mercure]

Hey Doug,

In a slightly playful spirit - are you sure the wood was black walnut?  Unless I miss my guess if the wood came from an "orchard" it was Juglans Regia -"English walnut" - as black walnut "Juglans nigra" has nuts that while much better tasting are too hard with too little nut meat for orchard use.  While the "regal walnut" (literal translation) should make a good neck it is a lighter colored and slightly more coarse wood than J. nigra which is a USA native of the eastern portion of the country.  One of my favorite trees but since the squirrels "plant" far more nuts than they remember to retrieve and eat I'm actually slightly "plagued" with J. nigra trees (especially since they release a natural herbicide and many plants won't grow under them - lost a lot a flowers).  Most of my friends have carved walnut walking sticks as gifts since I truly can't stand to discard anything "useful."  Now if I could figure out what to do with all the bamboo!

Rob

[Doug T]

Oh, I'm sure it is black walnut.  The Great Valley of California is littered with old black walnut trees.  This version of it is Juglens Californica, which has a very similar nut to the eastern black walnut, and the wood is a lovely dark brown.  Also, a number of the old orchards around here used to use a "high trunk" method of grafting, where they'd graft on at about 12 or 13 feet to a native tree.  Thus, the bottom 12 feet and roots were Juglens californica, and the top was English walnut.  Also, some of the nut processors out this way (think Blue Diamond) used to sell black walnuts at their plants to the local crowd, but did not export much.  My granny (who lived about 2 miles from a big Blue Diamond plant) used to make a black walnut tart from stuff they bought there.  Think a pecan pie, but more nuts than goo. 

[Mark McLean]

Rob

"Now if I could figure out what to do with all the bamboo!"

Bamboo makes good go-bar rods.  Pick the ones that flex well without snapping and fit some little rubber feet to them (buy packets by the dozen at hardware stores, get white cause the black ones leave marks).  Also, bamboo canes cut on an angle make a good disposable scraper for cleaning up glue squeeze-out. 

[Rob Mercure]

From every thing I know it should be excellent neck wood - I'm just perpetually ticked about mislabelling of, well, most "everything" - even when I go to an eatery and am offered "butter" for margarine and "cream" for half and half.  We don't as best I can tell, live in a Lewis Carrol fantasy where "words means what I want them to mean," although sometimes I do wonder when I listen to politicians.

 

Rob

[Tim Mace]

It's some of the best neck wood there is IMO but reading the grain can be a pain..I made a mandola neck w/it.Do it!Also tops,backs, & sides.........

[Dave Fox]

Yeah, after doing some more reading, and checking out the Wood Encyclopedia -- sapele is not mahogany, though it is basically a mahogany substitute.  It has very similar grain patterns, color, workability, durability, etc...... in almost every aspect it's pretty much the same as Mahogany.  My limited reading indicates that it is also a much more easily sustainable/replaceable tree.

 

I do have a really nice quilted sapele veneer to go on a resonator sometime......guess I'll have to look for a nice neck billet.

 

Dave Fox

[Glen H]

I've used Sapele for the past 5 years for SS necks.  I get better quality of wood and for almost half the price.  High quality Mahogany is getting harder to find and the price reflects it.

[Tim Mace]

This discussion has done nothing to change my opinion about Sapele as excellent all around instrument wood and since

it is of the same fam makes it close enough to mahog for me....not a wood scientist but if it sounds good,plays good,it must be goodwood.